Defining the pillars of human infrastructure

Transcription:

Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio for the authoritative record.

Michael Scarchilli (00:04):

Hi everyone, and welcome to The Bond Buyer podcast, your go-to source for insights on all things municipal finance. I’m Mike Scarchilli, editor-in-chief of The Bond Buyer, and today we’re exploring an essential topic that resonates at the heart of public finance human infrastructure.

In this episode, our executive editor, Lynne Funk, hosts an insightful discussion with two industry leaders, Beth Coolidge and Megan Kilgore, about how municipal finance can serve to address critical aspects of soft or human infrastructure. Beth, a leader in municipal finance with expertise spanning over three decades and the current head of public finance at Oppenheimer and Co. And Megan, the elected city auditor of Columbus, Ohio, bring invaluable perspectives on the role of public finance in creating more resilient, inclusive communities. They delve into a wide range of topics from affordable housing and workforce development to public health, climate resiliency, and digital access. In this conversation, our guests explore the innovations and financing mechanisms being used to drive social outcomes and improve quality of life, particularly in underserved communities. This episode provides a unique look into the transformative power of municipal bonds when it comes to human-centered projects, especially in light of evolving needs and the uncertainties surrounding economic policy and climate change. So without further ado, let’s dive into this inspiring conversation on the future of public finance and human infrastructure.

Lynne Funk (01:41):

Welcome again to Beth and Megan and welcome to our listeners. I am delighted to talk with my two distinguished guests today who are real leaders in this space. While some of our listeners might be wondering what we mean by human or soft infrastructure, doesn’t the muni market build infrastructure for people generally? Yes, but I think what will be compelling here today is really how we can distinguish as a market, the nuances of what certain projects can do for communities, how community members can become more involved in the decision making and processes. And perhaps most importantly, and maybe you’ll hear it from these too, but why telling these stories to maybe a broader audience, particularly at a time when there are uncertainties around elections and economic policymaking that could have a real impact on this market is so important. Beth, I would love for you to perhaps kick us off here. You’ve spoken about the concept of human, or as you called it, ‘soft’ infrastructure investments. Do you want to set the stage here for this audience broadly about what this means?

Beth Coolidge (02:47):

Yes, I would love to. It’s been really interesting in the 35-year evolution of my career to look at the transformation of how we come to market with certain projects. And I know if people think of infrastructure, water, sewer, roads, bridges, those are all very important. But I think especially post pandemic, we’re starting to see a need for a larger definition of infrastructure and how we fund those projects. So I’m really excited about this podcast and being able to talk about some of the most recent transactions that we’ve seen. Some have been actually recognized by the bond buyer as either Midwest deal of the year or deal of the year. I’m also thrilled to have Megan Kilgore with me here. I’ve known her both as a client and a public servant, and also during her time as a municipal advisor, and I know she’s got some really interesting perspectives on how we categorize the different types of human infrastructure. And so maybe I’ll throw it over to her real quickly to kind of set the table for what we’re going to talk about.

Megan Kilgore (04:04):

I’d be happy to, Beth, and it is certainly a pleasure to be here with you both. Beth is correct. I’ve been able to serve in different iterations across the prism of public finance and certainly most recently as my role as city auditor of Columbus, I’ve seen firsthand the power of embracing technology and modernization and public finance. Our office has done an incredible modernization, kind of 180, and right now we’re leveraging some cutting edge tools in AI and machine learning to improve operations. Things like many listeners who might oversee, let’s say revenues of their different roles and so forth, we can do a lot using AI to actually streamline operations, look at revenue analytics and all kinds of things that have revolutionized our way to own our data. But what I am most proud of and probably what has really taken my breath away as it pertains to optimizing ROI, is how to use those innovations to ensure that our infrastructure is actually supporting the people of our city, the human infrastructure that makes Columbus thrive.

(05:24):

So I’m excited to be here today, share some thoughts, and Beth challenged me to come up with, let’s say the five themes that we are starting to really see across our city. And I offered a little bit of context. I think it’s important to recognize that we are a large, large government. There is a business of government, and as the largest city in America to maintain triple AAA ratings, I recognize that we are able to do some things and invest in some things, and we have the resources to be able to kind of broaden our opportunities. So what we want to do today is create some kind of examples of things that can absolutely be executed downstream, meaning for a town of 4,000 people all the way up to a major U.S. city like Columbus. So around those five themes that we’re going to get into today is number one, workforce development.

(06:27):

Two, we’re going to talk about affordable housing. Of course that has to be at the top of the list, public health and certainly with respect to public health, inclusive of mental health infrastructure. The fourth is education and digital access. In the fifth, I will call it the equity focused infrastructure. And so to dive right in, let’s talk a little bit about workforce development. We’re really in this country, an inflection point, if you will. The jobs of tomorrow are being created today. And to any listener who’s part of especially a large public sector organization, you know what we learned during the pandemic about how poised we were, more importantly, not poised for the evolution of digital work, remote work, things like that. And I really do believe public finance has a role to play here. Bonds are not just about building our physical infrastructures. They’re about building and helping to support how we optimize the people who are working, how we re-skill our workers for the future, particularly in high growth industries like healthcare technology and green energy. And so to start things off, Beth, I know you’ve done some pretty interesting transactions. Talk a little bit about workforce at development and some of the re-skilling projects you’ve seen.

Beth Coolidge (07:50):

Well, it’s really been thrilling to work on a couple of these transactions that I’m going to highlight. The first one was actually a transaction that was done in 2023 by the city of Chicago under their sales tax securitization credit that actually won deal of the year. And it encompassed a number of different types of soft infrastructure, human infrastructure through a number of channels. One of which, as you mentioned, was community development slash workforce development. And the transaction included affordable housing, homeless support services, environmental justice type of infrastructure, but also community development grants. And through those grants, and actually also through some of the housing rehousing, they were able to do just what you’re describing, really do a deep dive into trying to develop these citizens who either through the pandemic or mental health or other addiction issues were no longer in the workforce. And first of all, get them housed, get them used to living in housing.

(09:21):

Because what people don’t realize sometimes is if someone’s been living on the street for years and years, it takes a special set of counseling and skillsets to get those people reacclimated to living indoors and having some form of regular mental health support training and the like. But to your point, Megan, there were a number of community development grants that were financed through that program. And I think that is a tool that many other cities, I know Philadelphia had a very interesting transaction in 2021 that encompassed a lot of the same types of softer human infrastructure, which also included these types of workforce development grants.

Megan Kilgore (10:14):

I’m curious post pandemic, one thing is abundantly clear to me, and that is public health is not a luxury, it’s a necessity. It’s become here at the city of Columbus, an urgent component, if you will, of our infrastructure discussions. And interestingly, I love history and my predecessor, the legendary huge Dorian, he was a little bit of a historical hoarder. And so we collected a lot of annual reports and really, really great stuff in the office from the time of the Spanish flu, which in order to kind of understand, especially the kind community toll of the Spanish, the pandemic presently, I really did go back and I read a lot of this stuff from the 1918 period. One of the things that struck me was how much our city grew in Parkland following the time of the Spanish flu. And I think when we talk about public health and mental health infrastructure, it is all encompassing, but certainly the idea of building environments and using frankly bonds to invest in more services, preventative care, health clinics, but also in parklands in wellness and preservation of our green spaces and the like. So these investments are really in our people, and I’d like to think in the long run, they will pay dividends by reducing economic and certainly social toll of untreated health conditions. But I saw, and I have not done a deep dive yet, Beth, but I saw earlier, maybe it was it last year, maybe even earlier this year, the city of Chicago did a pretty innovative program with street trees and specifically trees that helped kind of cool neighborhoods. I think you were a part of that transaction, right?

Beth Coolidge (12:12):

Yes. And actually that is the same transaction, which I think is why that transaction really personifies what we’re trying to describe here. There was an environmental justice component of that transaction along with the community development and workforce development, but the environmental justice component was related to the planting of trees. And some people might sit there and say, oh, why is that important to mental health or community development? Well, there was a study by the University of Chicago that very specifically focused on people’s environments, especially people who are in urban environments where they may not see as much green space. And it made a direct correlation between people’s sense of wellbeing and how they felt about their community if they had a tree planted on their property. It was highlighted in the Chicago Tribune, I want to say a year before we did this transaction, so probably in about 2022.

(13:24):

So it was very serendipitous that we were looking at what projects to put into this bond issue, and that was one that was highlighted by a local university aside from what we were trying to do. So as part of this transaction, there was a 75,000 trees will be planted in the city of Chicago over five years, specifically targeting communities that do not have much greenery. And it was really fascinating to read the article and understand, and it makes perfect sense when you are thinking about it. I mean, people like to go to parks, they like to see greenery, and there are large swaths of our city that are just basically devoid of any kind of greenery. And so it’ll be interesting to watch as we track the outcomes from this bond transaction, which I would like to note the city has agreed look at these very targeted investments in underserved communities to really look at the outcomes and be able to report back to bondholders on the outcomes because I think that type of data also will help inform other communities as to the benefit of doing these types of projects.

(14:51):

So yes, there will be 75,000 trees planted in historically marginalized and underserved communities over the next five years. And there is also a climate benefit as well in that there is part of this study, they were talking about how some of these communities see temperatures soar in the summer, much higher than other parts of the city that have a lot of trees. And so hopefully the tree canopy as well will help to stem some of the climate change we may be experiencing. And it might take a few years for these trees to get that large, but there are a number of benefits and they are directly related to mental health and wellbeing.

Megan Kilgore (15:39):

It’s the yes and form of infrastructure improvements. And I appreciate deeply the ability to kind of acknowledge that there are multiple directions, multiple benefits that can be captured. I think the difference that a lot of governments from those who are let’s say, just being exceptional and really forward thinking is that ability to really plan for one’s future. And a number of years ago, I would not have personally acknowledged that a street tree would be considered environmental and very forward thinking infrastructure. But today it absolutely does. It is hyper apparent to me. If you’re willing, I’d love to move on to the big elephant in the room, which is housing. And it’s certainly no secret that affordable housing is one of the most pressing issues that we face as a nation. Housing to me is absolutely human infrastructure and we have to get creative bonds that we’re seeing that are being deployed are certainly financing lots of different types of developments, especially mixed income. We’re integrating community services and certainly support like inclusive development. And Beth, for years we’ve seen this out of places like New York and San Francisco, Miami. And I am curious places like around even central Ohio, our suburbs, our suburbs, are grappling with the role of what they play in producing more affordable and workforce kind of zoned housing. What are you seeing across the national landscape and how would you recommend, let’s say a governmental entity, a smaller city suburbs, how would you suggest they learn about some of the creative financing opportunities that exist?

Beth Coolidge (17:34):

Well, it’s an ever evolving field as we know. I think 30 years ago, housing was just what you were saying or trying to help people who are first time home buyers or people who needed low income housing. But now we are starting to see a major expansion of what housing infrastructure should be. And one of the things that you mentioned was workforce housing. And I think that’s been the one thing that has really sprung up in the last few years that we’ve been focused on in particular for teachers. I mean, you see a lot of these expensive cities and suburbs and they’re exploding with children and their school districts, and there’s a shortage of teachers out there and people wanting to be teachers. And so how do you create housing for them that is affordable and will help you as a school district recruit the best and brightest to your district?

(18:43):

And so we’ve been looking at some innovative ideas with a number of school districts at the helm trying to figure out the best way to come about that. Is it giving teacher subsidies for housing? Is it to build your own housing that the school district would then own and be able to use to help recruit teachers into maybe a higher income school district where they might not be able to afford the property, right, to buy something or even rent something right away, or is there even anything available to buy or rent? So that is something that has been really, there’s been a push to focus on that.

Megan Kilgore (19:33):

That’s pretty incredible because I grew up in a rural location in Ohio, and my mother was actually a teacher for just shy of 40 years. And I have seen, I think a lot of times the bond buyer will pick up coverage of some of the deals across the country for housing and it’s teachers, it’s individuals who work at governments, public sector individuals who just really keep our country running. And it’s complicated for me as a leader here at the city. The complexities also occur in our ability to constantly consider what is out there in terms of available creative financing opportunities, thoughtfulness around federal programs and the like. And I think you’ve hit on something that is really important for people to acknowledge is that it’s constantly evolving and we’re going to continue as a country. I mean, both presidential candidates are speaking to it, so it’s just a matter of staying on top of it and trying to optimize when we know things.

Lynne Funk (20:43):

I actually would jump in here and ask how replicable are these workforce housing kind of deals? I think I’ve heard of a hospital being built and actually joining forces with perhaps a housing authority to make sure that the nurses, you talk about teachers, but that the nurses and the folks who work in hospitals have access to affordable housing and not just the workforce housing deals, but replicability of these deals of the Chicago deal, of the Philly deal. How would you talk about that to the audience? How do you tell that story and make sure that other perhaps issuers who are listening?

Beth Coolidge (21:26):

Well, I’ll jump in. I think what we have done very well as an industry is share our ideas and try and build on them and make them better. And I think what The Bond Buyer has done very well is to highlight some of these transactions on an annual basis, if not more, is through your reporting to get the word out that, oh, Chicago just did something that was really innovative and they’re going to be tracking the outcomes, and these are things that other cities should be looking at to see what pieces of it might work for them. And I think we’ve gotten to this place because of the great work that was done maybe 10 years ago by a city that decided to just do a bond issue to eliminate vacant property in certain neighborhoods. And the result being, and I think this is Philadelphia as well, that they saw a direct reduction in crime.

(22:30):

Well, wow, why don’t we take that and maybe add a layer to that of environmental justice and homeless support services all in the same transaction. And so what I think is we as an industry have done a very good job of getting the word out. And we as bankers, I will speak for my colleagues, it’s our job to go and amplify these deals to our clients and say, look, we understand that you’re having an X, y, Z issue. Have you thought about this? And so that would be my long answer to your short question. I’ll turn it to Megan now.

Megan Kilgore (23:12):

I think you, you’re a hundred percent right, and even for the smallest of towns, there are still principles that can be replicated. And I think that, I’ll give you an example. Honestly, I love research and on my desk right now, Beth, your team, I forget, I think it’s called constructing revenue solutions. Like many cities, we do need to look at just the way that we continue to leverage things like fees. We are an income tax driven city. That’s our primary source of revenue, but we have other ancillary, much smaller sources of revenue that we derive across the entire city. And a simple one that comes to mind is looking at cable and streaming services or today casinos to online sports betting. There’s a constant kind of evolution, if you will, of how simply government works. And it’s being really, I think, better poised, governments of all sizes are going to be able to take a really good look at what the environment looks like, inclusive of tax policy, whether or not their community is growing or losing population, whether it’s growing in terms of types of employers or if it’s pretty concentrated, things like that.

(24:44):

And try and be agile, which is really hard for governments to sometimes do. But to your point, it’s about really understanding who you are and then where you’re going in order to create, maybe I’ll call it the self-fulfilling prophecy of that future state.

Beth Coolidge (25:06):

And actually, if I could also jump in on another note, I know Megan, you and I had a conversation around the input that government is now seeking from taxpayers before they engage in some of these really large projects. And that’s something I have found very refreshing and rather new. So rather than big government or government going out and saying, well, we need to build five parks, and so we’re just going to take a cookie cutter stamp of what every park is going to look like and we’re just going to throw the same thing in each community and they’re going to look identical, or we need to build five libraries, and so we’re going to have a prototype and we’re just going to throw the same design into each community and it’s going to look the same. What I have seen is a lot more public engagement around what that individual park should look like, obviously within the construct of having a budget, but different communities need different things, and I feel like government has really been focus more on taking that to account because it is the taxpayer who is paying for this park or this library or this community center.

(26:23):

And so they should be the ones who are helping drive what that looks like and what services are provided.

Lynne Funk (26:32):

Thank you both. This has been already such a great conversation, but we’re going to take a quick commercial break and we’ll be right back. And we’re back with Beth Coolidge and Megan Kilgore talking human infrastructure. I think. Now, Megan, you laid out some areas that you two are going to cover. What do you want to get into next? You touched on, I think the interesting thing, right, is that so many of these overlap, mental health, public health, affordable housing, workforce development, what’s next?

Megan Kilgore (27:11):

So one thing that I think if we’re going to prepare our workforce for the future, education has to be at the front and center. And historically, as a nation, we’ve done a great deal of bond financing for schools and certainly for broadband access. But now more than ever, it’s the idea of digital infrastructure being as important as more traditional utilities. Gray infrastructure, the digital divide is unacceptable. Every child, every family here in Columbus we believe deserves access to digital tools and opportunities. And I think our industry does have the maybe unique power to help close this gap using strategic municipal investments. So let’s talk a little bit about education and digital access and some of the financings that have occurred across the country. I’m curious, Beth. We do have a lot of stuff going on here. We really have to build out the infrastructure to be able to fully bring everyone on, but it also includes the factors that are most important around financial literacy, digital literacy, helping people feel more comfortable, more trusting, establishing those trusted linkages to help people get access to jobs and the like. Have you been a part of any transactions for broadband or the digital infrastructure?

Beth Coolidge (28:47):

Actually, yes. And I think once again, the pandemic really highlighted the disparities between rural areas and urban areas and what that access looks like. As our children we’re all forced to be homeschooled for at least a year and sometimes longer in certain communities. The access to broadband, the internet, the digital infrastructure, those disparities became very, very apparent. And we have been working in a number of different states in very innovative ways to help build that infrastructure all pretty much in rural areas, but through using municipal bonds. And typically these bonds are issued through a conduit, either a state bond bank or we’ve been part of a few transactions that have been through local rural counties. And that is how important it is. And I think people used to think the internet was such a luxury. It is definitely a game changer if that is something that your child or your family does not have access to. As you mentioned, Megan, that puts you well behind, not only from an education standpoint, but from job access, from learning how to use the internet from just any kind of learning. So we have been seeing a real increase in a number of these transactions,

Megan Kilgore (30:34):

The complexities of digital infrastructure. It kind of leads into our final theme, which is before we talk about futurist topics, which I’m really eager to as well, but we’re seeing a lot around the Midwest in places that are experiencing, I’ll call it like an industrial revolution, an evolution maybe is the better term around advanced manufacturing. Here in central Ohio. Microchips are every single day I could count on a number of hands how many times I hear the word chips. And for me, I look constantly at the equity of that infrastructure, meaning because of some of the sizes of these projects across the us. And certainly when you have big federal legislative actions like the CHIPS Act or even funds coming out of the IRA or the BIL, sometimes you need land. And in order to build those very, very large scale projects, oftentimes you’re not going to find that land within, let’s say, the kind of realm of the core urban city.

(31:51):

Instead, you’re going to have to go outside. And that’s the case for central Ohio where we needed a lot of land for the huge intel, multi phased fab plants. With that infrastructure being outside of the core city, we do provide regional water and sewer. And so it’s really important to kind of balance that pendulum, if you will, of investing as we grow as a region, but not burdening any user of population of our residents, of our rate payers unfairly. And so we also have, it’s an enviable position to be in, but we have a lot of population growth and we have a lot of patterns of growth from folks moving here from across the entire country who are either looking for opportunities or they’re looking for places to grow their developing businesses, trying to be very thoughtful about equalizing that growth and sharing in that prosperity. I’m curious when you’ve seen some of your projects in this country recently, I’m going to guess that you’re seeing maybe that kind of middle tier of governments being as thoughtful as even the City of Chicago project that you referenced that has so many different points of seeking more human-focused equity and human-focused infrastructure. Are you starting to see that also trickle down to, let’s say the mid-sized governments?

Beth Coolidge (33:29):

Yes, actually, we are working with several clients across the country on large scale manufacturing projects, just as you described. And to your point, they’re in order to have access to that amount of land, you do have to move a little bit away from an urban area. So we are seeing the challenges around the power because a lot of these manufacturing plants require a tremendous amount of power. You were mentioning chip manufacturers and the like, and there’s a great deal of power needed water, sewer infrastructure, and then also workforce housing because you have to bring workers out there. And in a number of these areas, you may be adding a few thousand jobs into an area that does not have the housing to accommodate those families. A number of them are high paying jobs too. So how do you create immediately an environment where people would like to be recruited there? So yes, we are seeing a lot of these types of projects throughout the country. They do touch on all of the themes that we’ve been talking about over the last half hour or so. And I do think the infrastructure required in order to accommodate these large projects is important and people are being very thoughtful around how to make that work.

Megan Kilgore (35:09):

I’m so glad that you referenced the kind of composition or quality of jobs because it’s something that I’m personally struggling with a bit because of the fact that our jobs that are growing are disproportionately higher skilled, higher wage paying. And I’ll tell you, even in my time as auditor of Columbus, when I first came into office, we looked more at job numbers in terms of job count, how many jobs, how many people are working today, it is imperative that we not just look at job numbers, but more importantly we look at the type of job, the composition of that job. And lemme kind of unpack that a little bit. This is something that a town 4,000 could also do, but if you are considering wage growth, how has the composition of your local economy changed? So for example, in Ohio, the Cleveland Fed just produced some research earlier this month, and I’ll kind of paraphrase, but they looked at the percentiles of income levels in the state of Ohio, the bottom 10th, meaning the lowest income producing percentile, the bottom 10th only grew between 1979 and 2018, I believe it was about 1.6%.

(36:41):

The 50th percentile grew, I want to say it was closer to the 6% and the 90th percentile, the highest wage earners grew by closer to 37, 30 8%. And I feel that I’ve been really challenging to find the data to support what I’ll say or qualitatively. We are seeing significant increase in need with our nonprofits. We’ve seen incredible wage growth, especially among certain industries, yet we are anticipating that more and more individuals are falling behind. And it is the nature of a region like ourselves that have tons of jobs in the technology, FinTech, healthcare tech, a lot of healthcare ecosystem jobs and so forth. So I wanted to say thank you for kind of acknowledging that as auditor, I am so always seeking jobs that I’ll call GED to PhD, where you have this opportunity and that that’s advanced manufacturing. That is the reason why some of our innovative manufacturing programs are so music to my ears that we’re able to help individuals grow up that income ladder alongside more advanced skills.

(38:01):

And I know as a nation, as we continue to kind of figure out, and this will be a good segue as we kind of go into our futurist themes, is where we’re headed and being mindful that we are evolving ourselves, our expectations of our workforce and the expectations and needs of our infrastructure to meet where our country is headed. So if we consider this Beth that the future of our human infrastructure is about being forward thinking, let’s just say being bold because I’m very optimistic, recognizing what we think the world might look like in five, 10 and maybe 20 years from now, what I’d love to talk with you about is how do we finance projects today that will prepare us for that future? And so to start, let’s talk about ai. It’s not a futuristic concept. We are using it every single day in this office. And I’m going to guess that you’re using it at your firm as well, but already we’re seeing it redefine our public services and we are using it every single day to sleuth through incredible amounts of disparate data sets, things that even the most, I’d say incredibly complex Excel model would not be able to do. And we are doing some really, really, really cool things to better understand our economy, make policy recommendations and the like. So let’s start there. How are you using AI right now?

Beth Coolidge (39:39):

Well, we have some really cool modeling that we have where we can, rather than take three analysts a week to do a data dump into a bond debt service model, we can do it much faster. So where we may have had to have three analysts build a debt profile, we now only have one, which has been nice. It frees up people’s time. You don’t have the young people sitting at till two in the morning working on a debt profile. But I think to your theme, more futuristic forward thinking data rules, our business and outcomes rule, our business. And so I feel like we are on the verge of being able to really synthesize, I guess, the outcomes for a lot of what we’re doing and parse through what are best practices not only in construction finance, but also what is the best programming? How do we reach people in these communities that have been underserved?

(40:48):

What are the programs that work and what are the ones that do not? What is the best and highest use of a design for a park? What are the best in use, highest uses for people who are potentially incarcerated? I didn’t get a chance to talk about the Indianapolis Community Justice campus, but they implemented a mental health intake center as part of their community justice campus because they recognized through doing their research that in a number of occasions you don’t want to charge people for minor offenses. It makes more sense to connect them with services. So I see AI helping us to serve our communities better and to create better programs and also to through that create better infrastructure.

Megan Kilgore (41:47):

I love that as we continue to build out what we call smart cities, it’s not just about the technology, it’s about how do we use the technology to best serve the people who live in our cities and whether it’s health, education, economic mobility, I love that you shared that. I would say it has revolutionized the way that we can engage our citizens from simply individuals trying to work with our tax system to more importantly us understanding how our people are working so that if we make recommendations around policy, it’s actually really meaningful. But I a hundred percent agree with you, Beth. I think that’s fantastic. If you don’t mind, I’d love to know with respect to climate resiliency, we’ve already touched on the idea of the street trees and so forth, but are you seeing any other interesting community-based resiliency programs that strengthen, I’ll say the social fabric of communities, making them both resilient to climate and to the shocks related to those changes?

Beth Coolidge (42:56):

One of the things that I think our industry really needs to focus on is the insurance issue where we are seeing climate change really impacts certain communities. Obviously we’ve just had two major hurricanes in the Gulf. We are now seeing individuals who no longer have access to insurance and how do they rebuild and what does that look like? There has been a call for the federal government to stand up some form of a disaster or a larger disaster relief program, but I know that California, after their wildfire, they had a really bad wildfire year a few years ago. They were looking at innovative solutions to help there. I know Florida has a self-insurance program. I’m not sure if I think they’re looking to really bolster that, but how do we as an industry weigh in on innovative ideas to really help people who have been displaced are trying to rebuild, be able to do that? And that’s one of the biggest, I think, challenges because there are large parts of this country that are impacted that no longer or will no longer have access to mainstream insurance.

Megan Kilgore (44:22):

I think every Instagram ad that seems to come before me now is something about taking a supplement, doing something more exercise around longevity. And so I kind of would love to maybe end with a little discussion around just that, the fact that as a nation, we’re living longer, but we’re not necessarily living healthier. So in the future, I do think, and I’m curious to your thoughts on this, I do think that we will see a trend in governments looking more at their responsibilities of financing, let’s say long-term care, maybe healthcare elder care facilities, and even healthcare innovations like advancements with telemedicine to be able to meet people better where they are. And so I’m just curious to, do you see that as an emerging trend as well?

Beth Coolidge (45:22):

So senior living as, I guess a sector took a rather large hit during Covid, and we’re starting to see them come out of that, there’s definitely a need there. It has always been a very robust segment of the market, but there does need to be, I think, a little bit more support around some of these existing facilities. And how do you keep them as a going concern given some of financial struggles that occurred during Covid. So I do agree. I think there will need to be new and more innovative housing, if you will. What does that look like? Does that look like multi-generational housing where I saw an interesting program, I think it was on 60 Minutes, and they’re looking at people who are elderly, living alone, taking in college students, and they’re actually programs at certain colleges where they don’t have enough housing for their students, where they will find an elderly person who maybe owns their own home and buying a student who needs housing, and they will pair them up. And the outcomes have been really pretty amazing. We have as a nation, I remember my grandparents lived in multi-generational housing where the grandparent, the adult parent, and the grandchild are all living together. So it’s interesting to think about how we combat this because we do have a very large portion of our population that is aging, and we are going to have to think of some very innovative ways to combat the lack of housing for those people.

Megan Kilgore (47:24):

I love that you’ve shared that about your grandparents. I think that just talking with you, I think our industry is really special when it comes to understanding the future of human infrastructure and its relevance. And I will tell you anyone who’s listening and you’re noodling on something for your local community, you have a number of professionals who are really eager to help. I think that makes our industry so special. I think we recognize that we have a responsibility to try and leave this place better than we found it, and it’s a tremendous opportunity to be able to use our talents in municipal finance to actually shape the communities of tomorrow. And Beth, I mean this sincerely. I know you’ve always taken my calls when I’ve just been noodling on something, but I really appreciate it, and it’s been an absolute pleasure sharing some of these trends with you today.

Beth Coolidge (48:25):

Well, thank you Megan, and thank you to the bond buyer. Very happy to share my thoughts and in a way that I get to interact with you, Megan, and thank you again.

Lynne Funk (48:39):

Thank you both. This has been such a great conversation. And I think what I hope my big takeaway is, and I hope our listeners as well, these could be podcasts individually on each of these topics. And that’s something I do want to continue to explore here. One of my other takeaways from this is that these are positive developments for this industry, right? These are things that are good for the market, for the people who benefit from it, and I look forward to continuing to discuss all of these with you and others. So thank you so much again for your time, and we look forward to seeing you all soon again.

Michael Scarchilli (49:27):

Thanks, Lynne.

Lynne Funk (49:29):

Thank you.

Michael Scarchilli (49:30):

We hope you enjoyed this episode of the Bomb Buyer Podcast. A big thank you to Beth Coolidge and Megan Kilgore for sharing their expertise on the impact and potential of human infrastructure financing, and to our own Lynn Funk for leading such a compelling discussion. Here are a few takeaways from today’s conversation. One, Beth and Megan highlighted the concept of human infrastructure, emphasizing that municipal bonds are not only about funding physical projects like roads or bridges, but also about financing the social frameworks that support communities. Projects that focus on affordable housing, mental health services, and public health infrastructure are becoming increasingly essential to ensuring long-term resilience and prosperity. Two, our guests discuss the importance of community specific approaches to infrastructure. Rather than one size fits all solutions, more public finance leaders are working to tailor projects like workforce housing and digital access to meet unique local needs.

(50:33):

Whether it’s planting street trees in underserved areas to improve mental health or building workforce housing to support essential workers, these targeted approaches create a positive lasting impact. And three, Megan and Beth underscored the need for innovative solutions in the face of growing challenges like climate change and economic inequality. From climate resilient infrastructure to creative financing for digital literacy and education access, there’s a growing recognition that future-focused financing must address social equity alongside economic goals. Thank you once again for listening to this episode of The Bond Buyer Podcast. This episode was produced by The Bond Buyer. If you enjoyed this episode, please hit like and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform, and please rate, review and subscribe to our content www.bond buyer.com/subscribe. Until next time, I’m Mike Scarchilli signing off.